About the author: John Renken

A self proclaimed “scrapper” since childhood, John Renken grew up with a burning interest in physical challenges and a strong competitive spirit which has led him to develop quite an impressive reputation in the professional fighting community. Reaching the pinnacle of his career, Renken now has over 68 professional mixed martial arts and boxing matches under his belt and many first place titles spanning three different continents. A former Satanist, Renken’s life has taken many interesting twists and turns along the way to redemption. He now pastors a church called Freedom Church and writes about topics of interest in our country.

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  • John Kirkwood

    Great, great article John. I’ve found this to be true, as well. I pastor in Illinois and everything you said is true. Very insightful. Thanks for the column.

  • http://www.churchformen.com/ David Murrow

    Thanks for quoting me!

    • John Renken

      I am honored you read it and hopefully I did you justice.

  • Patricia Bennett

    This is really bewildering to me. Ya I’m a female but have quite a few manly men in our family. To men, this is how you are coming across.
    You want a “Man Cave” to sit in instead of a normal seat, you want beer and pretzels served while communion is served, you want thee restroom to be a bare brick wall to whizz on, cement floor and a drain in the center so all waste can be hosed down it, your attire shall be huntin’ clothes (newest camo patteren if possible) or sweats & T-shirt, you plan on singing in abnorml voice burp and fart to music, when its time for the Benediction you stand in the isle like a sprinter waiting for the “on your mark”!!

    Now this is how I was brought up. Every Sunday you went to Church with parents, we dressed up female in dress unless it was really cold out and male wore a suit & tie. You sat there quietly, you sang to the best as your ability.

    We had a nice church, long hardwood pews, there were always seasonal flowers up at the front of church. The classrooms were in the basement. The floor was painted, the walls were either a light blue or mint green. Which ment the mens restroom was blue with blue curtin matchin garbage can, woman’s restroom was mint green with everything matchin. What IS wrong with that? If someone was visiting from out of town at least it was clean and presentable!
    Your not to be a heman in church but you should be civilized. As an adult act as an adult put boyishness with the boys.

    • John Renken

      Patricia, I would ask you to go back and read my previous posts. I for sure am not suggesting those things. However I am suggesting that we stop with erotic love songs to Jesus, the flowery decorations all over the place, and the berating of men. I also wonder if the church you describe reach lost men and thereby their families or if it was a family church that never really grew? This is an honest question not an attack.

      • WellNowDear

        John, in my church we have an organ and a hymnal. The songs go back a long way and all have a teaching in them. I don’t know anything about the so called “love” songs. We are few in number and are not attractive to the he men at all. There is a large church next door with a full parking lot. I see the men going in with their tee-shirts and jeans. I have heard that that church doesn’t teach any other doctrine but “we love Jesus and He loves us”. Now I don’t know what you mean by feminizing exactly since I haven’t seen any of that. Our pastor is male. We don’t allow women to be pastors and have authority over men. We all have our roles in the church.

        • dave_aka_lambsev

          “Feminizing” is an interesting word, for the BODY of Christ is the BRIDE of Christ. That does not make men into women. It is the devil who promotes homosexual and heterosexual sin who does that.

          • mom2marine

            Yes, the evil ones will twist the bible’s words in the worst of ways….choosing when to take the bible literally and when to take the words figuratively.

            Personally, I believe we need to
            “See through God’s eyes, and love through God’s heart. Pray for Him to open our eyes to the world at the end of our pointing fingers” (Great song).

            My point is that many Christians need to stop worrying about the splinter in their brothers eye (how they sing, dress, etc) and worry more about the plank in our own eye (judgment of others, critical spirit, hard heart etc) and UNITE because that is the only way to win any war.

          • dave_aka_lambsev

            Dear Mom2marine, Here is an outstanding quote.

            “There was an interview with a Dutch church historian, and they asked him, these BBC people, about the Dutch church, and he made the most interesting remark, he said, ‘We have dozens of protestant denominations and Christian groups because to the Dutch person truth is more important than unity.’ And when I heard it, I thought, I’ve tried to say in a whole sermon what you said in one sentence. What he meant by truth and rightly analyzed, is: “my interpretation of the Bible, my dogmatic views, my doctrinal views.” But Jesus said, ‘I am the truth.’ Truth is not a teaching; truth is a person. And if you have that person you have that truth, and in that person is always unity. But if we put our understanding of the scripture and our doctrinal views higher than the person of Jesus… and I’m going to say maybe something very sharp, and I want to say it respectfully and honorably… we worship idols. Anything we place above the Lord Jesus is an idol. Our unity is not in a teaching, it is in a person and in a person you always find one another.” ~ Jan Sjoerd Pasterkamp

          • mom2marine

            That is, indeed, an outstanding quote. Thank you for sharing.
            Have a blessed week. -_-

        • Lidia Smith

          I was sadden to read that your church does not allow women pastors. God used women. Have you not read on the leader, teacher/prophetess of the university in God’s word. How the man came to ask for her help in interperting the word. I have let her name out so you can do some reading and maybe you will see how many more women God used. How about the woman that led the army of God into battle because there was no man that would do so! Your church should hold a bible study on “women of God.” God uses whomever He pleases. Before you thiink ill of me, please note that I study God’s word daily. I read the KJV1611, the Companion Bible, the Massorah, the text of the Hebrew Bible as officially revised by the Masoretes from the 6th to the 10th centuries ad , with critical notes and commentary), have learned Hebrew and Greek to understand the words used in the scriptures and the Strong’s Concordance. I don’t believe anyone has the right to stiffle anyone that God uses to proclaim His word. To me that is like committing an abortion.

          • KittyKittyKit

            In all your Bible study, my dear sister, how did you happen to miss I Timothy 3: 1-7??

            Bishops, Elders, Pastors, Deacons are all commanded the SAME THING.

            If any MAN desire the OFFICE OF A BISHOP, HE desires a GOOD WORK.

            A BISHOP, then, must be found BLAMELESS (that’s not aquittal from, but absence of any charge to begin with)

            The “HUSBAND” of ONE WIFE. Translation: A MAN MARRIED TO A WOMAN. Not “single” or “unmarried” person nor a FEMALE.

            “…..one who RULES well HIS own house, having HIS children in subjection with all gravity.’

            “……for if a MAN knows not how to rule HIS own house, how shall HE take care for the church???

            The Apostle Paul writes: “Therefore I suffer not (do not allow) the WOMAN to teach over the MAN, but she is to be in SUBJECTION…”
            “That the WOMEN teach the YOUNGER WOMEN…..” That the woman TEACH THEIR CHILDREN……
            “For ADAM (MAN) was NOT DECIEVED but the woman BEING DECIEVED was in the transgression.”
            “Wives, OBEY your OWN HUSBAND…”
            That’s a lot of scripture you seem to be dancing around to advance your point. Just accept what it says. It doesn’t need INTERPRETATION unless you want to get around what it says so plainly and simply.
            EVERY WORD OF GOD IS PURE, it is like SILVER tried in a fire seven times.
            Before God had his word set to pen and paper, he made sure EVERY WORD was PURE.
            God is NOT A MAN that he should LIE.
            Jesus said….”The SCRIPTURE (the written word) CANNOT be broken.
            God, our Heavenly Father does NOT change his WORD for ANY of his children……..NO EXCEPTIONS.
            He watches over HIS WORD to perform it.

          • Paul

            Excellent!!!

          • paulie2

            Thanks for that. Those are exactly the passages I was thinking of when I read Lidia Smith’s post. We have a church here in town with a female pastor and they don’t even realize they are not following God’s word (or maybe they do and don’t care).

          • Antiques

            One of the greatest problems so called “Christian” churches have, and by that it includes so many professed “Christians”, is that they do NOT follow what The Christ taught, but have adopted old fables and outright lies written down over almost 2000 years. Constantine caused 1 of those lies to begin, by decree, and began a connection of a series of Prophecies to start. Jesus gave a sermon which included Matt: 5-17,on to show that He never changed or deleted any laws or did away with any prophets or prophecies. The churches mostly avoid this teaching, as it conflicts with their practices. One practice is to go to church on the Sun-god’s day, thereby insulting God and Jesus who taught against such false teachings. Only a very FEW churches go to church on The Creator’s Rest Day or Sabbath… Yet Jesus calls on HIS people to turn BACK to His WAY and Laws… and then can Grace begin in real effect… if it is done out of LOVE or RESPECT for and to God. Anything else is DIS-respect to The King of kings.! Jesus also said the he who loves God the Father, should also love Him (Jesus/Y’shua) – and he who Loves Jesus/Y’shua must also love God the Father. Jesus was a Jew. God created the Jewish Religion. Just because some Jews did not follow properly, is why they suffered terribly at the hands of men over 2000 years… Now it is time for more suffering of the “Christian” churches, because they ignore the call by The Christ, to “Come OUT of (their own) Babylon” ( “come out of babylon” and kamaut longbabilon” (on FaceBook) is also a teaching springboard platform for everyone who wants to know more about what God really wants from us as HIS people. And it is NOT so confusing or hard to understand as we may imagine. God made it SIMPLE, man made it COMPLEX!

        • John Renken

          Kind of proves my point.

        • MARYANN33

          Many women have stepped up because the men are not willing.

      • dave_aka_lambsev

        Can you expect lost men to love a warrior who would lead them into the battlefields of this world of flesh? At least give them Jesus who on a cross saved us from everlasting war (hell). Give them Jesus who by going defenselessly to His death sealed the day when we will beat all our swords into plowshares.

        If this nation goes FURTHER into war, or civil war, it needs to be with the utmost reluctance. The church could pray the nation back into the shalom of God would she take her eyes off chevrolets, apple pies and television long enough to pray and talk and learn with Jesus.

        Matthew 11:28-30
        28 Come unto me, all ye that labour and are heavy laden, and I will give you rest.
        29 Take my yoke upon you, and learn of me; for I am meek and lowly in heart: and ye shall find rest unto your souls.
        30 For my yoke is easy, and my burden is light.

        2 Corinthians 10
        1 Now I Paul myself beseech you by the meekness and gentleness of Christ, who in presence am base among you, but being absent am bold toward you:

        2 But I beseech you, that I may not be bold when I am present with that confidence, wherewith I think to be bold against some, which think of us as if we walked according to the flesh.

        3 For though we walk in the flesh, we do not war after the flesh:

        4 (For the weapons of our warfare are not carnal, but mighty through God to the pulling down of strong holds;)

        5 Casting down imaginations, and every high thing that exalteth itself against the knowledge of God, and bringing into captivity every thought to the obedience of Christ;

        6 And having in a readiness to revenge all disobedience, when your obedience is fulfilled.

        7 Do ye look on things after the outward appearance? if any man trust to himself that he is Christ’s, let him of himself think this again, that, as he is Christ’s, even so are we Christ’s.

        8 For though I should boast somewhat more of our authority, which the Lord hath given us for edification, and not for your destruction, I should not be ashamed:

        9 That I may not seem as if I would terrify you by letters.

        10 For his letters, say they, are weighty and powerful; but his bodily presence is weak, and his speech contemptible.

        11 Let such an one think this, that, such as we are in word by letters when we are absent, such will we be also in deed when we are present.

        12 For we dare not make ourselves of the number, or compare ourselves with some that commend themselves: but they measuring themselves by themselves, and comparing themselves among themselves, are not wise.

        13 But we will not boast of things without our measure, but according to the measure of the rule which God hath distributed to us, a measure to reach even unto you.

        14 For we stretch not ourselves beyond our measure, as though we reached not unto you: for we are come as far as to you also in preaching the gospel of Christ:

        15 Not boasting of things without our measure, that is, of other men’s labours; but having hope, when your faith is increased, that we shall be enlarged by you according to our rule abundantly,

        16 To preach the gospel in the regions beyond you, and not to boast in another man’s line of things made ready to our hand.

        17 But he that glorieth, let him glory in the Lord.

        18 For not he that commendeth himself is approved, but whom the Lord commendeth.

      • Lidia Smith

        I think the whole point is missed. Why churches are decreasing in size? Maybe it’s because God’s truth is not really there. Throughtout the scriptures Christ tells us of everything that is to come. Have you not read it! (Matt.24) He says this so we know that the whole Bible is to be read and studied. In the bookd of Isaiah28:9,10, He gave us directions on how to teach his word, prescept by precept and line by line. He also lets us know that he would bless those that are espousing his truth. Out of seven churches, there were only two churches that God approved, (Rev. 2:8-12, 3:7-10) Smyra and Philadelphia. They both taught about those that claim they are Christians but are of the synagogue of Satan. There is a saying ” Teach the truth and they will come.”

        • Charie

          I have to question whether you’ve ever attended a United Methodist Church. One of the things I noticed was that a disclaimer was attached to every mention of a miracle. “We don’t believe this actually happened”. It tells me that either people are willing to hear what they wish to hear or they shut their ears off as soon as they enter a sanctuary. The previous pastor, who I had heard preach many times said the same things the female pastor did so apparently it’s the church itself, not individual pastors.

          Once a supply pastor told a story about a lesbian in which she “suddenly discovered” as an adult that she was a lesbian. Do with that what you will, I left the church because that was the straw that finally broke the camel’s back. Actually, that combined with a reliable report that some of their pastors (retired) were marrying same sex couples. The scriptures and gospel are read in church but little attention is paid to either.

      • MARYANN33

        Read the book of Solomon and read Jesus’ love songs to us…

    • dave_aka_lambsev

      Dear Patricia, I’m 63 and have come to this conclusion, few men are in possession of the whole counsel of God. The author above lifts up a seventy year old pastor riding into war as an example of godliness holiness. I lift up Jesus. I think you will agree that my choice is the wiser, the safer and the winner! John 18:36 Jesus answered, My kingdom is not of this world: if my kingdom were of this world, then would my servants fight, that I should not be delivered to the Jews: but now is my kingdom not from hence.

      • Robert Burke

        David Murrow and John Renken,

        Take a look at “In That Day Teachings” … http://www.inthatdayteachings.com

        Perhaps you will see a way from “milk” to “meat.”

        “Meat” is very, very, very rare these days because it takes the understanding that Churchianity wrongly preaches in favor of fear, greed and laziness.

        Fear comes from dispensational-raptor teachings. Greed comes from Give-to-Get prosperity shenanigans, i.e. indulgences sold, indulgences that are fake and illogical. Lastly: emergent gobbledygook is really lazy-thinking.

        So much for milk. This is why men can’t stand milk Churchianity.

        Now for the meat: Meat means getting rid of the above bad doctrines, which allow bad demons in our lives. Bad doctrines give right to bad spirits in a person. So what are the good doctrines?

        First, Ancient paths of self-correction. Second, Paul’s high ways. These two things redound unto Christ-in-You, come now, whom we must honor. Honor unto whom honor is due.

        So we salute the Christ-in-You in another, when we see it. We never call men: “guys.” We don’t use upside down words: “cool, incredible, unbelievable, crazy-good-preaching, stuff, Holy Ghost, kick-off, etc.”

        We understand blessed is he who comes in the name and the nature of the Lord. Unless we do that… our house will remain unto us desolate, devoid of Christ-in-You.

        Christ-in-You can’t come in men who have bad doctrine, or milky ideas.

        Also, check out King David’s living, breathing and fighting methods at http://www.battlebornsystema.com or better yet: http://www.russianmartialart.com … because the Russians a thousand years ago learned and kept from the traveling Hebrews the warrior’s way of love : Russian Martial Art Systema.

        • dave_aka_lambsev

          Milk is food, and it is used as food in many ways, grownups eat it in many forms. Some of the longest living people on earth are eastern europeans who subsist mostly on yogurt.

          Remember King David did not get to build the House of God, the 1st Temple because of the blood he had shed in many wars.

          You write: “We understand blessed is he who comes in the name and the nature of the Lord.”

          The scripture says merely “in the Name of the Lord.” Why do you add the word nature? If you should add anything it would be the Spirit of the Lord, yes? No?

          • Robert Burke

            Paul was frustrated teaching milk to men who needed meat of the spirit, which is something that redounds unto Christ-in-You, which is why we must bless men (and women) who have Christ-in-You.

            The name is the nature. We need to salute the nature of Christ when we see in in someone, else our home become desolate of the indwelt Spirit of Christ.

            Did you turn aside, like Moses did, and study http://www.inthatdayteachings.com ? Milk churchianity teaches that Moses turned aside, but the hard and true teaching is to actually turn aside.

            Stuff is a word best not used, as it is kind of an upside down word and God wants our yeas to be yeas and our nays to be nays. Other words to be avoided are “guys, cool, unbelievable, incredible, crazy-good, etc.”

        • Ort

          Unfortunately, men are responsible for the “milk churchianity”……TD Jakes, Joel Osteen, Rick warren, rob bell, Doug pagitt………..
          Women aren’t so thrilled with it either, I got news for you.

      • http://www.facebook.com/people/Craig-J-Townsend/100003945426141 Craig J. Townsend

        You dont think that there is a call for a holy war? A war agaisnt those who wish to enslave humanity and turn the US and the world into a neo-communist hell hole? How many churchs have gone green? How many ascribe to the reigning ideology du jour? You think staying on your knees and singing hymns will stop it? A man on his knees is a man in defeat. a sword in one hand and scriputre in another, maybe, but no sword and a limp wet theology and your done! You think the bible alone prepares you for the subtle attacks of your sworn enemies when every denomiation I see has already gone belly up and given in? Id rather read Thomas Pain then Paul.

        Ayn Rand was far more of a prophet then any pastor of the last 100 years. She told everyone what would happen and where everything was going if it was not stopped. None Dare Call It Treason sold thousands of copies and told it like it was way back in the 60s, no movement arose. Bishops, Priests, pastors, minister’s et al were all AWOL and still on conservative sites all I see is vacuous bible quotes and mush headed idiocy. Dead from the neck up, empty for the waist down, that is what xianity is today.

        • dave_aka_lambsev

          There has been war since satan was cast down. We don’t need to engage human beings in bloody warfare to be at war. We can fight the devil and demons all day long in prayer and fasting. The weapons of our warfare are NOT carnal… We are to fight against the evil and wickedness in the heavenlies, and expose and reprove wicked men. But to slay them? Jesus wants to save them! Perhaps it will come to the point where the only two camps will be the saved and the anti-christs, but then we could all just be sent home by a quick beheading.

          Are we too earthly minded to be any heavenly good?

          • Robert Burke

            Well, demons live in folk if they believe lies that give right for the demons to be in them.

            Typically, there are three ways Churchianity allows this to happen, and it happens from three base emotions: fear, greed or laziness.

            Dispensational-Rapture Preaching preaches fear, and little else. Fear demons love to live in folk who believe in rapture claptrap.

            Prosperity Preaching preaches greed and little else. Greed demons love to live in folk who believe in self-dealing “give-to-get.”

            Lazy Preaching includes emergent gobbledygook, mojo-jive emotion, dry-bones pabulum, or dead-spirit talk. All preachers doing this that are believed by sheep, have sheep with demons of laziness.

            Now, Christ can’t do His Christ-in-You thing in mentalities that are so low as to be unaware demons are in them because of fear, greed and slouch.

            So this is called milk Churchianity. And it is a tuff thing indeed to get “men” taught of milk and milk-demonized to expunge their demons, because it involves a heart and head change.

            For example, men of rapture-dispensation have to see how blind that faith makes them to tomorrow, how their kids run away from the stupidity of it all, and how, at core, their soul has a lot of fear. The answer is to not believe the lie anymore.

            Ditto with greed and lazy doctrines taught by milk church.

            Then, after you get those rats out of your brains and inner soul, you need to put in good things: Self-correction, self-abasing humility, perspective against egoism, historical knowledge, strength and courage not gym-mirrored-aren’t-I-great based, high ways of Paul…. and all of this redounds unto Christ-in-You…. which also requires one to salute Christ-in-You in fellow man and woman, something most milk-taught super-proud-and-rigid folks refuse to ever do.

      • John Renken

        Dave what do with Jesus who rides into battle with a blood dripped robe and a sword riding on a white horse with an Army (us) that slays the rebellious nations?

        • dave_aka_lambsev

          When Jesus commands the armies of heaven to return (your reference is from Rev Ch. 19 yes?) I want to and hope to be with Him. If at that time He commands me to spill the blood of unbelievers I will obey Him. But I note that it is with the sharp sword word of His mouth that He slays His enemies at that time.

          Rev 11
          11 And I saw heaven opened, and behold a white horse; and he that sat upon him was called Faithful and True, and in righteousness he doth judge and make war.

          12 His eyes were as a flame of fire, and on his head were many crowns; and he had a name written, that no man knew, but he himself.

          13 And he was clothed with a vesture dipped in blood: and his name is called The Word of God.

          14 And the armies which were in heaven followed him upon white horses, clothed in fine linen, white and clean.

          15 And out of his mouth goeth a sharp sword, that with it he should smite the nations: and he shall rule them with a rod of iron: and he treadeth the winepress of the fierceness and wrath of Almighty God.

          16 And he hath on his vesture and on his thigh a name written, King Of Kings, And Lord Of Lords.

          • John Renken

            Yep. Pretty masculine and awesome picture dont you think?

          • dave_aka_lambsev

            define masculine, it is not a word I have read in the bible, nor is feminine.

          • MARYANN33

            male and female, made he them….

          • dave_aka_lambsev

            It is a prophesy Ken, and I expect it to happen one day! Right now we are in Joel Ch. 3 somewhere I think. But one day we will be in Isaiah Ch. 2:1-5. You know there will be no marrying (sex) in heaven, and no bloodletting either or am I wrong?

          • MARYANN33

            In those days I will pour out my Spirit even on servants–men and women alike.

          • John Renken

            Maryann33 this was not against women. I full concur that women will ride along side of us and have equal access to God and His Spirit.

          • MARYANN33

            I just had the experience of the anti woman pastor at my last church…It was very unpleasant and sad…I did not have liberty to use my gifts for the help of others. I have walked all my life with God and can be very useful to the body if I don’t have a woman hating pastor….I am waiting for the revival outside the church…the Lord will then direct my steps himself, not forbid be to even touch a person,,,,especially not ever a man…

        • MARYANN33

          When Jesus comes on his white horse we women will be riding with him on our white horses,,,,Jesus says…and our own swords..

    • JRJ21

      See how you are?You mock masculine things.Men don’t want to go to a “Church”Where they will be surrounded by feminine atmospheres that speak boredom and “be good isms”while ignoring his true nature.The “church”Is NOT A BUILDING,why can’t you get that,it’s NOT A LIFE SUCKING RITUAL.try living your faith in all of life instead of pushing your worship of churchianity

      • dave_aka_lambsev

        Many men go right over top of masculine to macho and on to tyrant. Others run away to become cowardly lions. Because they do many women try to fill the absence of the man of God. That was not meant to be. But dressing in camouflage and learning mixed martial arts is not the way to become a man of God. Going to the cross and laying down your life for your friends is the way. Losing your life for the Messiah’s sake is the way! When you do that Jesus will bless your salted sacrifice and your leadership will prosper along with your soul!

      • Ort

        So in your opinion it is ok for the men to trash women when they equate the feminine as “weak” or “wrong”? That is just as bad. Never mock a woman’s femininity by equating it with some kind of defect. I hear it all the time and I’m sick of it.

        Patricia was not mocking men. She was making a point. I honestly don’t know what the heck men want anymore.

        And because of all the “Christian” men who would use the Bible to hit women over the head and “keep them in their place”, I honestly don’t care now.

        Men, you blew it. You dropped the ball, you abused the women who were supposed to be in your care, and now you have the chutzpah to blame us for it. And you wonder why there is such strife? Look to yourself before you blame others.

    • mom2marine

      Your second paragraph is not God’s definition of a godly man.
      Godly mens’ first relationship is with God, second is with his wife, third with his children, then family, church family and neighbors…
      ….no where in the bible can I find that anyone should esteem themselves in the manner of today’s men, women and children.
      Real he-men have the strength to be Godly first.
      Good comment Patricia.
      Have a blessed week.

      • John Renken

        Who was this to? I am kind of confused.

    • Guest 3

      My husband is very manly. When we adopted our son, he decided to convert to Christianity. His presence in church is very important to me, our son, and for his own personal and spiritual growth. Our daughter, who went to church with me weekly, only saw her father at church during special occasions, while our son participated in the weekly services with his father & myself. Our son sees that church participation is important to his father & to myself while our daughter sees it as a special occasion event and not important. Subconciously go to church with your mother compared to going to church as a family is what she learned by example. I am not male bashing or woman bashing but men are important in my life and since I have given my husband control of our family, I have seen him return to me much support in everything that is good. If he’s not receiving good (honor, trust and respect) from me, how can he return honor, trust and respect to me?

      After 45 years of marriage, I love and appreciate his manliness and intelligence even more so than before. I feel his support and am more appreciative of him now since we are one.

  • charlie

    one of the main problems is that women are not as discerning as men and will accept a place where the people are friendly even though they may be in total scriptural error. There are so few churches worth attending that men just cant find a place fit to attend.. For example your article, among other things , talks about clergy.laity as a part of the church when in fact that is totally against scripture. Those kinds of things, along with the social club atmosphere have driven the Real Christian man away.. Of course most of the real Christian men do as scripture requires them and teach their family themselves.

    A big part of this is due to the fact that most churches are run by what the bible calls hirelings not real Godly servant ministries. Christianity has not declined like the churches show. They have just started following what they learn by reading their bibles for themselves, and have come out of the harlot church system. These men are following scripture as they are supposed to do and many have taken their children out of the indoctrination camps called public schools for the same reasons. many have church in their homes with a few other families where they can allow God to lead instead of some guy with a program that does not allow the Holy Spirit to move and meet the needs of the people. Men are learning that real scriptural “church” is people, not a system or a building or a program, but 2 or more meeting in the name of the Lord to hear from HIM,

    The church system has failed the people and that is why our country is now controlled by unGodly evil men and women.
    That is why Christians are marked by our evil government as enemies, not church people but active Christians that are following God is what they are afraid of.

    • WellNowDear

      I agree with you in that the large churches have failed to defend the faith. If the churches had been against abortion it would never have been legalized. If they all were against homosexual marriage, it wouldn’t happen. Their leaders are cowards mainly. Silent because they either agree with sin or they are afraid of loosing their tax exempt status.

    • dave_aka_lambsev

      Women are in some cases much more discerning that some men. I think Joni Erickson Tada is certainly more discerning than Hugh Hefner, and also some men pastors I might name.

    • Paul

      Very well stated. You have said a lot of what I would have said.

      The clergy-laity thing is a real problem. And, so many of the so-called “clergy” are indeed effeminate men, and that is repulsive to real men.

      So many of the churches today are nothing more than country clubs with amenities and programs that you can either participate in or opt out of.

      As far as the actual ministry is concerned, most churches allow men to collect the offering, pass out program bulletins, or do other “secular” duties. Charles Spurgeon encouraged his men to get out there in the highways and hedges and PREACH the Gospel, and he started a school so he could properly train men for the ministry.

      Charles Spurgeon himself was never ordained (he was ordained by God, but not men) and would not accept the title of “Reverend.” In today’s churches, you must go off to “seminary” in order to proclaim the gospel. If churches were doing their job, they would be training men for ministry, so they would not have to leave house and home and go off to some seminary where they may indeed lose the faith they have, and I know this from experience.

      The author in this article is exactly right about the church being feminized, and truthfully there isn’t much that non-ordained men can even do in today’s churches.

      But, God is indeed building His church and the gates of Hell are not prevailing against it. There are a lot of home churches out there that are operating under the radar, and God is working through them. And, there are also small independent churches that are holding fast to the faith once delivered to the saints.

    • Ort

      What? Really? Women are less discerning then men? It is EXACTLY this type of women bashing that drives women from the men. If we can’t even get simple respect from so called “Christian” men, then why would we suffer to play second fiddle to you? Shame on you.

      As to the author of the article stating that a man won’t get saved if his wife gets saved first, that is foolish nonsense. If the man refuses salvation because his fragile male ego can’t handle the fact that he didn’t get saved first, then he deserves what he gets. How asinine.

    • Lidia Smith

      I just want to correct you in one single thing…some of us women that do know the word of God do decern from the true teaching of His word. Chruches have become a social gathering and lacking God’s true teaching. I guess you can say the politically correct ministers/preachers/teachers are inflitrating the churches. And you are also right, the churches have failed the people. They have waterdown God’s word. Christ throughout His word tells us what we are to expect in the end times, the prophets prophesized it and yet churches are not espousing God’s true word and preparing His children for what is to come.
      Man should be the spiritual leaders of their home, but if they are not, the women are to be and by this I mean by walking and acting as Christ did. You may see women in church more than man because they also love God’s word and believe they are doing what is expected of them from God. Unfortunately, like I said before, the teaching that goes in the church itself would make all the difference, and that is the true word of God.

  • dave_aka_lambsev

    John 18
    28 Then led they Jesus from Caiaphas unto the hall of judgment: and it was early; and they themselves went not into the judgment hall, lest they should be defiled; but that they might eat the passover.

    29 Pilate then went out unto them, and said, What accusation bring ye against this man?

    30 They answered and said unto him, If he were not a malefactor, we would not have delivered him up unto thee.

    31 Then said Pilate unto them, Take ye him, and judge him according to your law. The Jews therefore said unto him, It is not lawful for us to put any man to death:

    32 That the saying of Jesus might be fulfilled, which he spake, signifying what death he should die.

    33 Then Pilate entered into the judgment hall again, and called Jesus, and said unto him, Art thou the King of the Jews?
    34 Jesus answered him, Sayest thou this thing of thyself, or did others tell it thee of me?
    35 Pilate answered, Am I a Jew? Thine own nation and the chief priests have delivered thee unto me: what hast thou done?

    36 Jesus answered, My kingdom is not of this world: if my kingdom were of this world, then would my servants fight, that I should not be delivered to the Jews: but now is my kingdom not from hence.

    37 Pilate therefore said unto him, Art thou a king then? Jesus answered, Thou sayest that I am a king. To this end was I born, and for this cause came I into the world, that I should bear witness unto the truth. Every one that is of the truth heareth my voice.
    38 Pilate saith unto him, What is truth? And when he had said this, he went out again unto the Jews, and saith unto them, I find in him no fault at all.
    39 But ye have a custom, that I should release unto you one at the passover: will ye therefore that I release unto you the King of the Jews?
    40 Then cried they all again, saying, Not this man, but Barabbas. Now Barabbas was a robber.

  • http://www.facebook.com/people/John-Clement/1169952473 John Clement

    thank you for the message.

  • dave_aka_lambsev

    Hebrews 13
    10 We have an altar, whereof they have no right to eat which serve the tabernacle.
    11 For the bodies of those beasts, whose blood is brought into the sanctuary by the high priest for sin, are burned without the camp.

    12 Wherefore Jesus also, that he might sanctify the people with his own blood, suffered without the gate.
    13 Let us go forth therefore unto him without the camp, bearing his reproach.
    14 For here have we no continuing city, but we seek one to come.

    15 By him therefore let us offer the sacrifice of praise to God continually, that is, the fruit of our lips giving thanks to his name.
    16 But to do good and to communicate forget not: for with such sacrifices God is well pleased.

  • dave_aka_lambsev

    Hebrews 12

    12 Wherefore seeing we also are compassed about with so great a cloud of witnesses, let us lay aside every weight, and the sin which doth so easily beset us, and let us run with patience the race that is set before us,

    2 Looking unto Jesus the author and finisher of our faith; who for the joy that was set before him endured the cross, despising the shame, and is set down at the right hand of the throne of God.

    3 For consider him that endured such contradiction of sinners against himself, lest ye be wearied and faint in your minds.

    4 Ye have not yet resisted unto blood, striving against sin.

    5 And ye have forgotten the exhortation which speaketh unto you as unto children, My son, despise not thou the chastening of the Lord, nor faint when thou art rebuked of him:

    6 For whom the Lord loveth he chasteneth, and scourgeth every son whom he receiveth.

    7 If ye endure chastening, God dealeth with you as with sons; for what son is he whom the father chasteneth not?

    8 But if ye be without chastisement, whereof all are partakers, then are ye bastards, and not sons.

    9 Furthermore we have had fathers of our flesh which corrected us, and we gave them reverence: shall we not much rather be in subjection unto the Father of spirits, and live?

    10 For they verily for a few days chastened us after their own pleasure; but he for our profit, that we might be partakers of his holiness.

    11 Now no chastening for the present seemeth to be joyous, but grievous: nevertheless afterward it yieldeth the peaceable fruit of righteousness unto them which are exercised thereby.

    12 Wherefore lift up the hands which hang down, and the feeble knees;

    13 And make straight paths for your feet, lest that which is lame be turned out of the way; but let it rather be healed.

    14 Follow peace with all men, and holiness, without which no man shall see the Lord:

  • Hotnike

    Maybe we ought to start with the male leadership in the clergy.

    • dave_aka_lambsev

      Maybe we ought to see that the division between “clergy” and “laity” is something God delivered us from through Jesus our One and Only High Priest? Study the letter to the Hebrews and you will see that the ground is level at the foot of the cross. Nevertheless we should not allow women to usurp authority over men.

  • kenhowes

    If it were only true that most of the men who have stopped attending church did so because of false teaching in the churches or unmanly pastors. I am a member of a church of the Lutheran Church-Missouri Synod. It would be ridiculous to claim that our pastors either teach false doctrine or are unmanly. Unlike that other church body that calls itself Lutheran, we do not ordain homosexuals. We do not preach that homosexuality is acceptable. We do not ordain women. Most leadership positions in our churches remain held by men–congregational presidents and elders are men. Our teaching today is the same as it was when Martin Luther, Philip Melanchthon, Martin Chemnitz, and the other Reformers and Confessors were living and teaching. We are not losing members, at least not fast, but neither are we growing. We have about 2.4 million members nationwide, a figure that is fairly stable.
    But the issue of men not attending is the same. On any given Sunday in any of our churches, two thirds of the adults present are women. Some of that is older ladies who have outlived their husbands; women are usually longer-lived than men. But most of it is husbands whose wives go with the children while they stay home.
    Some of this is men whose jobs require them to work on weekends, so that they are either working at the time of the service or coming off a night shift where they worked all night and now all they can think of is getting to bed. Some work a night shift during the week so that they are used to sleeping 8-4 during the day. Those, too, are a minority.
    Mostly, it’s men who have become worldly. They consider that their duty to their families is to bring home a check; anything else is incidental. Church, in that scheme, is incidental, and if they don’t feel like going on a given Sunday, they don’t go–and that becomes a habit. Satan is at their elbow in no time, saying, “Maybe next week; this week, you just want to sleep, or watch the political talk shows, or the sports news, or whatever it is you’d rather watch on the TV.”
    Another problem is youth sports leagues which increasingly play their games on Sunday mornings. This pulls children, especially boys, away from church and Sunday school. Boys grow up with the idea, “I’m a boy. I play sports. Girls go to Sunday school.” They grow up to be men with the same attitude.
    Worst of all, when you absent yourself from church, you absent yourself from preaching and the sacraments. These are the means by which God gives His grace to us. Yes, the Bible is at home, but it does not replace hearing preaching or receiving the Communion or hearing the absolution. Further, as Martin Luther pointed out already in the 16th century, the ones who say, “I can pray and read my Bible at home” are usually the very ones who won’t do it.

    • dave_aka_lambsev

      “Our teaching today is the same as it was when Martin Luther, Philip Melanchthon, Martin Chemnitz, and the other Reformers and Confessors were living and teaching.”

      Daniel 12:4
      But thou, O Daniel, shut up the words, and seal the book, even to the time of the end: many shall run to and fro, and knowledge shall be increased.

      Perhaps even the Missouri Synod needs updating?

      We need to go back before Augustine and Origen and learn/relearn from Peter, James, Jude, John and Paul AND JESUS. Then we can TODAY learn from the Holy Spirit the things that pertain to these last days. Today may be your last too, though I pray you live to be 120 for Jesus Name sake. Amen AMEN

      • kenhowes

        The Gospel needs no updating. What Luther, etc., taught IS what the writers of the New Testament taught. What the apostles saw, what the evangelists reported, is what it is; it doesn’t change.

        • dave_aka_lambsev

          I’m not suggesting any revision of the texts. I believe that God will be providing those who seek it a greater understanding of the Gospels, the law and the Prophets, all the Holy Bible.

  • pikemaster1

    I also think that it’s that a lot of men are afraid of the “Jesus freak” type profile that comes with going to church. They are afraid that their “GOOD” friends will make fun of them because they attend church on Sunday ? We all know that if they were really good friends,they would either go to church along with them ,or back them on their choice. I do go to church every Sunday and have to almost drag my family in with me on Sundays.Our pastor is one of my very best friends that I have met since joining the church a few years ago. We Fish,hunt,have started a gospel band,in which we perform 2 or more times a month ,shop the local sporting goods stores and shoot along with just enjoying each others company. Some of my “GOOD Friends” are not much seen around my home anymore. I believe they are afraid that God might rub off on them ? LOL. But in truth,the ones that do come around still,ask and talk about the church and most even tell me that they would like to attend church (someday).I always try to get them to stop putting it off and come to church with me. Most of them love to hunt and /or fish ,and I tell them to come join the pastor and me on our next trip out. They usually will tell me that they will,but most don’t show up. I’ll keep trying to get them involved and maybe someday it will work. Would love them to come hear the word of God soon !I don’t think our church is really too girly for them and we have almost the same # of men ,not quite ,but close that attend,so that shouldn’t be a problem . God Bless

    • dave_aka_lambsev

      Most are afraid of Jesus, what He might ask or command them to do and be. And having arrived in church many make themselves comfortable with a gospel of their own fashioning, rather that submit themselves to the Word of God. (Why do I say this? Because I struggle with the same issue: How much can I trust God? Can I trust Him if He says go to Ghana? Or teach my Reformed Church on the evils of replacement theology? Or have a prayer meeting in my living room? Or cast our demons?)

      Hebrews 4:12
      For the word of God is quick, and powerful, and sharper than any twoedged sword, piercing even to the dividing asunder of soul and spirit, and of the joints and marrow, and is a discerner of the thoughts and intents of the heart.

  • dave_aka_lambsev

    Many (male) pastors are too proud, narcissistic and/or fearful to give any authority to anyone, especially some MAN who might be a more effective leader that they are, or preach or teach more effectively, or be more popular. We live in a world where competition is the preferred modus operandi. Competition is war! The church leaders are not to be at war with each other or their fellow members, competing and protecting “offices” and influence.

    Winning the lost is winning them back from the devil and that is a spiritual war, not a war for foreskins and filling the pews with your circumcised!

    Let the Holy Spirit control, not the Pastor. Let those who are gifted by God to lead do it humbly, diligently, charitably and in the Spirit of Holiness and of God who IS AGAPE love.

    1 Corinthians 12
    18 But now hath God set the members every one of them in the body, as it hath pleased him.
    19 And if they were all one member, where were the body?
    20 But now are they many members, yet but one body.
    21 And the eye cannot say unto the hand, I have no need of thee: nor again the head to the feet, I have no need of you.
    22 Nay, much more those members of the body, which seem to be more feeble, are necessary:
    23 And those members of the body, which we think to be less honourable, upon these we bestow more abundant honour; and our uncomely parts have more abundant comeliness.
    24 For our comely parts have no need: but God hath tempered the body together, having given more abundant honour to that part which lacked.
    25 That there should be no schism in the body; but that the members should have the same care one for another.
    26 And whether one member suffer, all the members suffer with it; or one member be honoured, all the members rejoice with it.
    27 Now ye are the body of Christ, and members in particular.
    28 And God hath set some in the church, first apostles, secondarily prophets, thirdly teachers, after that miracles, then gifts of healings, helps, governments, diversities of tongues.
    29 Are all apostles? are all prophets? are all teachers? are all workers of miracles?
    30 Have all the gifts of healing? do all speak with tongues? do all interpret?
    31 But covet earnestly the best gifts: and yet shew I unto you a more excellent way.

    • katchaturian

      Could we be unintentionally masking John 14:12 to the point where we are ineffective and becoming more so?

      • dave_aka_lambsev

        Do we understand what the works referenced are?

    • MARYANN33

      My last ineffectual pastor was afraid of women doing anything….They seemed to be able to do it better.

      • dave_aka_lambsev

        Anything? I hope you have and effective pastor now. But WHAT do you expect and effective pastor to allow of women or of men for that matter?

        • MARYANN33

          The gifts are supposed to operate in the body of Christ in the church and the pastor is to judge, but not prevent the gifts from manifesting, just know when they are not of God and certainly not prefer men to women….My very good pastor retired…Alas…

          • dave_aka_lambsev

            I hope you will pray for your ineffectual pastor and not allow any woman to usurp authority over him. May God instruct all your congregation in His ways which are holy, just, righteous and lovingkind.

  • CharlieFromMass

    Nice to see the Armenians getting a nod, speaking as one.

    During the several genocidal attacks that occurred from 1895-1920 (the last being a five-year-long attempt at outright extermination), many of the local priests (Apostolic [Orthodox] and Armenian Catholic) and ministers for the Protestant Armenians, fought alongside the soldiers and villagers defending their families and homes from the Turkish gendarmes. If that isn’t a display of manhood, I don’t know what is.

    Want a really cool story about a real Armenian man? Look up St. Vartan. I’m sure you’ll all find the story inspiring.

  • dave_aka_lambsev

    2 Chronicles 7:14
    If my people, which are called by my name, shall humble themselves, and pray, and seek my face, and turn from their wicked ways; then will I hear from heaven, and will forgive their sin, and will heal their land.

    My fear is that many who know this verse do not have a sufficient vision of what healing looks like, and are unable to receive the healing God deeply longs to give them! I know (learned very recently that) this is a crisis in my own life!

  • dHb

    After 62 years of attending fundamental Christian churches, studying and memorizing scripture and teaching it to others I left the church and am now an apostate to Christianity not because of any issue mentioned here but because I “investigated” the Bible with an open mind rather than just “studying” it and afterward I concluded that it is nothing more than a haphazard collection of Jewish folklore, fable, mythology and superstition. Most Christians are so caught up in what they have been indoctrinated with that they cannot investigate the Bible with a truly open mind for fear of rejection from friends and family and their refusal to use their God given ability to reason. Same holds true for Islam and the Quran.

    This is a conscientious decision I made that I do not regret one bit and I am sincerely glad to be free of the shackles Christianity places on their “followers” aka sheeples. Now dear Christian readers you are free to condemn me and say nonsense such as that I never really did have the “spirit” and proclaim that I am destined for the mythological hell that you read about in your book of superstition. I am free but I do understand and respect your need to keep inhaling the opium of the people.

    • kenhowes

      doesn’t sound like you did much investigation. Rather, it sounds like you approached it with a desire to have it found false. Most of the writing that claims to discredit the Bible is pure guesswork and depends on a presupposition that miracles and theophanies did not happen. Repeatedly the claims of those who would like to say that the Bible is as you say, when there was concrete proof one way of the other, have been shown to be false and the Bible’s account true. Some writers actually tried to claim that there never were kingdoms of Israel and Judah, that David was solely a mythical figure. Then a ninth-century BC monument was unearthed referring to “the house of David”. Many scholars insisted that the Old Testament accounts involving a king Sargon in Assyria had to be false–then his tomb was found. The destruction of Sennacherib was thought to be fiction–then the account of his sons confirmed it. Israel was, according to some pretty eminent scholars less than a century ago, not an existing people before about 1000 BC, but rather there were various tribes. Then a stele of the Pharaoh Menerptah which can be dated with some precision to about 1205 BC was found referring to Israel. There is in fact not a single contradiction between the Old Testament and science where a conclusive answer has been found and the scientists were right!
      In the New Testament, by any standards that would ordinarily be applied to documents of that period, the New Testament is more credible than many documents whose authenticity and authoritativeness are unquestioned–for instance the histories of Tacitus and Suetonius. As older and older manuscripts are unearthed, it is clear that earlier theories that the Gospels were written in the late first or early second centuries are wrong. There is one fragment of Luke that appears to be from the period 60-70 AD. That fits together with the way that the book of the Acts ends with Paul in Rome alive and no mention of Peter’s death. Both the Gospel of Luke and the Book of the Acts pretty plainly date from 60-64 AD. Mark is considered to be at least as old as Luke, and Matthew to be about the same time period. While the final chapter of John was evidently written later, there is reason to date most of the text of that Gospel to before 70 AD as well. These books were written in the lifetime of those who had seen the events recounted. There are no opposing books written at that time. There is no report anywhere of a Pharisee or a Roman officer writing or saying that it isn’t so.
      The first hostile mention of Jesus is in a second-century Jewish document which describes Him as an “evil magician”. In other words, His worst enemies don’t deny He worked miracles, only that they were divine in origin. But the miracles are the hook on which you and other enemies of the Bible want to hang your hats, because you say they can’t happen.
      The key to it all is the Resurrection of Christ. One after another, the men who saw it went to their deaths maintaining it. Not one recanted. They were generally offered the opportunity to save themselves by saying that it was not true–none took that opportunity. When someone says something, there are only four possibilities. One is that he is mad. A second is that he is lying to gain some benefit. A third is that he is lying to avoid some harm. The fourth is that he is telling the truth. There is not the slightest evidence that the Apostles were mad. They stood to gain no benefit from telling the story of Christ’s Resurrection. Far from avoiding harm, sticking to that story brought them harm. That leaves only the fourth possibility–that they were telling the truth. They saw the risen Christ. They saw the miracles that even hostile Jews, in their first writing concerning Jesus, admit happened.
      If there is a shred of good in you, revisit the Bible. I also recommend warmly the books of John Warwick Montgomery. The Bible is far more credible than you put on. Your final sentence is an obvious falsehood. Do you really respect those you call “sheeples”? Do you respect those who “keep inhaling the opium of the people”? It seems to me that you inhaled a poison worse than opium–if you’re using that phrase, it sounds like you’ve signed onto Marx.

      • dHb

        You have certainly honed your skill as a Christian apologist Ken. I have no qualms with the geographical and archeological truths in the Bible. But there are dates and references to events that are totally inaccurate or are contradicted from one book to another. Also I find disgusting and barbaric the many implied instructions in the Old Testament from God to slaughter men women and children of those who opposed Israel and the second class attitude toward women. No, I do not believe in miracles. Snakes do not talk, donkeys do not talk, ax heads do not float, water does not turn into wine, lepers are not healed by bathing in a dirty river or just by the command of someone, blind folk are not healed by putting muddy spit on their eyes, people do not walk on water, storms are not calmed just by rebuking them and the dead do not come back to life here in this world.

        Some of the greatest support I find for my conviction that Christianity is the greatest hoax ever perpetrated is the complete lack of reporting by the many historians of that time on the fabled exploits of Jesus the God man. Yes, I do know all about Flavius Josephus and the Testimonium Flavianum which has been discounted by most scholars as having been altered by self serving Christians. There were many very detailed and reputable historians in that era both Roman and Jewish and their total silence on a man who did miracles and rose from the dead is an indication to me that they never happened. At his death saints came out of the grave and walked into Jerusalem and were seen by many and not one single historian reports it? Sorry Ken, you are entitled to your fantasies but I no longer want anything to do with them.

        I am now a very content Deist. I believe in God and that he designed and created the universe and that he may be known by studying that which he has created and the unchangeable laws of nature he set in place which are there for all mankind to see and learn about him from not just those that read a certain book. And NO, I am not given to the socialist or communist philosophy of Marx but believe his quote about religion is spot on. Here is an even better quote: “God gave us reason, not religion” … Thomas Paine

  • JoAnn Dolberg

    Good point, John! Men are supposed to lead, and that according to Scripture. They lead by their study of the Word of God, in their speech and in their actions. Can you imagine walking up to someone like Moses or Elijah and asking them what color we ought to paint the walls? The Word of God is where we should be, and knowledge is not necessarily understanding. What a world this would be if all would live according to God’s rules, in thought, word and deed! That world is coming! In the meantime, we had all better study in order to present ourselves as approved unto God, workmen who do not need to be ashamed! Christ has crowns and coverings of glory set aside for us, but if we do not work in partnership with the Word of God, (Jesus, John 1:1, 14; Rev. 19:13b), we will not receive them and thus will have no part in God’s stated purpose (Genesis 1:26) for us. The Word of God, (the Man and God, Jesus), will lead us if we allow Him to do so.

  • http://www.bibleversusconstitution.org/ Ted R. Weiland

    John, thanks for this excellent article.

    If I might add, when the Greek word “ecclesia” (poorly translated “church”) is understood in it’s fullest sense–that is, as a Christian body poltic–this applies as much to government as it does to our houses of worship.

    For more, see online Chapter 28 “Amendment 19: The Curse of Women’s Suffrage” at http://www.bibleversusconstitution.org/BlvcOnline/biblelaw-constitutionalism-pt28.html.

    • Ort

      Wow. Barefoot, pregnant, unable to vote. What next? A burkha and you to be allowed to beat and rape us, then “honor” kill us? Both you, and the author of that article are disgusting. The fact that you believe such a twisted, convoluted, pathetic attempt at subjugating half the Body of Christ, is sickening.

      • http://www.bibleversusconstitution.org/ Ted R. Weiland

        What’s disgusting is to compare Yahweh’s perfect law and altogether righteous judgments (Psalm 19:7-11, etc.) with Islam’s Sharia. Do not be surprised if you do not have to answer to Yahweh for this.

        • Ort

          Tone down the hypocrisy. That you would EVEN post an article that dares suggest women shouldn’t be allowed to vote because SUPPOSEDLY women are so stupid they vote with their heart instead of examining a candidates platform, YOU are the one who will answer for your bashing of half the body of Christ!! How dare you!!

          Possibly unsaved, socialistic liberal women might behave that way, but to suggest that a conservative Christian woman would is downright insulting!

          • http://www.bibleversusconstitution.org/ Ted R. Weiland

            And I suppose you will next try to convince us that your responses weren’t emotional–they sure haven’t been Biblical.

            Try rejoicing in how God made you and the wonderful role He designed for you to fill–you’ll live a happier life.

        • Ort

          Right. And you are allowed to be demeaning and insulting to the female half of the body of Christ because your incorrect attitude mistakenly thinks God approves of your behavior. Check yourself, your attitude and the way you lord it over women, before you post in wonderment why you are getting so much flak.

      • http://www.facebook.com/RobertAlexander.Salvage Robert Alexander

        Wow, your disrespect of God and his Righteous was are overflowing – Repent woman, love the truth of the fullness of Gods holy word.

        You have a problem with biblical authority being exercised – reflect

        • Ort

          “Woman, you are inferior. I am a man, I know better than you. I will do my best to make sure you are painfully aware you are a lesser being. You should be barefoot and pregnant with no voting rights. I am man. I have spoken.”

          Why the heck don’t you reflect on your over macho, insulting, misogynistic posturing. You have some serious issues with your need to be domineering over women. Repent, man. You have a serious problem with how to treat others, especially women. No woman would want you cracking the whip over them.

          You are hardly the Biblical example of manhood, who offers his life for the woman. No, you must dominate, subjugate, insult, and make the woman aware she means nothing next to you. And you wonder why you and your ilk get so much resistance? Unbelievable. Shame on all of you.

  • mom2marine

    “See through God’s eyes, and love through God’s heart. Pray for Him to open our eyes to the world at the end of our pointing fingers” (Great song).

    Christians…we need to stop worrying about the splinter in our brothers eye (how they sing, dress, etc) and worry more about the plank in our own eye (judgment of others, critical spirit, hard heart etc) and UNITE because that is the only way to win any war.

  • katchaturian

    Was LDS until DNA exploded the myth, but still feel the faith has the right ‘modus operandi’. Now attend a Baptist church that has a similar hierarchy that, too, includes women. Though raised in genuine knee holed dungarees I eventually learned to shine shoes and dress up for the Sabbath thus giving the Lord the best shot. Have taken some flack for dressing up, but have never looked down the end of my nose at others. Wore a tie every day as an educator and fight through doubt every day. Have always liked scrappers and you fit the bill.

  • KittyKittyKit

    Gosh, if only Jesus had been more wealthy, he could have, and I’m sure he would have, taken the 12 deciples to the Roman Colliseum to watch the Gladiators kill one another, and if only they had martial arts classes and KARATE classes, I’m sure Jesus would have taken them, himself, and later become a 13 degree black belt and a master instructor himself, and the deciples could have added great insights on self defense to correct that seemingly unsettling sermon on the mount edict.

    This weird “un-masculine” bit about “turning the other cheek”, or the bit about when someone steals your coat, give him an extra piece to go along with it, or when you are being coerced to carry the backpack of a Roman soldier for a mile, that you smile and say, oh, please, let me carry it for 2 miles for you. All this must have been some kind of early “green peace” or “flower-child” phase he was going through.

    And goodness knows, J.C. and the 12 would have been “redeeming the time” because the days are evil, by spending hours together watching football, basketball, baseball, soccer, golf and all the other important ” High-Fiving, telling jokes, winkin’ at the cheerleaders, and kickin’ back and havin’ a few (root) beers too.

    Gosh, Christianity could have been so much fun and entertaining beyond the rock band praise sessions where the youth lead the worship GIG.

    You are correct about men not wanting to go to church but the solutions you set forth will only continue the slide.

    Why don’t we try doing what the BIBLE says, and do what the BELIEVERS did for the first 300 years of the church, BEFORE, they ever bought into the heretical idea of building LARGE CHUCH BUILDINGS (oikiadomes) and met in small family dwellings (oikias) where the tithes and offerings they collected were EQUALLY DISTRIBUTED to those in attendance in their own small groups FIRST, and the needs in their own small group was ministered to FIRST before they sent their money off to far flung corners of the earth, leaving the local ministry DESTITUTE.

    A time when they KNEW the tithe (10%) was all about FOOD for the local FLOCK and NOT for the unbeliever, and the FREE WILL OFFERINGS came out of YOUR remaining 90% AFTER you had given the FIRST 10% to God. And NONE of the tithe or free-will offerings went to build OKIADOMES.

    Return to a time when church LEADERS, went out into the highways and hedges and compelled folks to join them in their OKIAS, (small home dwelllings) where they would “come together” (synogoge) and FELLOWSHIP, (koinonia) which meant to “share in common” their FOOD (tithe) and MONEY (free-will offerings) and talk about Jesus and what he’d done in their lives, and the MIRACLES the Lord had performed throught them to his glory, and how the GIFTS OF MONEY were distributed to the saints in other home-fellowhips (after they had taken care of their own groups needs).

    Return to the time where being a church LEADER, was NOT a college educated position, as there are NO EXAMPLES of God raising up LEADERS out of the “schools of the prophets” that were set up in the days of the prophets, AND the church LEADER was NOT a PAID POSITION, though folks were encouraged to give a DOUBLE PORTION to those who ministered well in the word.

    The days when the LEADER of the COME TOGETHER in the small home dwelling, had his OWN JOB and ministered to others out of his OWN income which he had gained by working quietly with his OWN HANDS as the Apostle Paul instructed EVERY WHERE and in EVERY TOWN he set up churches in. That the spiritual PARENTS LAID UP TREASURE for the spiritual CHILDREN, not the CHILDREN for the PARENT.

    Days, when the ECONOMY that our Heavenly Father set up for HIS CHILDREN through proper disbursement of the tithes and free-will offerings among HIS CHILDREN at HIS TABLE FIRST, providing that stable LOVE FEAST at HOME, first, and then INVITING the world to join them and GIVE the STRANGER / VISITOR / TRAVELER the PORTION that was set a side for the ORPHANS, WIDOWS, and STRANGERS that woul visit their small home fellowships, and thereby TASTE and SEE that the Lord is Good.

    They didn’t send them off to the GOVERNMENT for food stamps and unemployment.
    People being loved and cared for, fed and clothed by charitable people, who care, DO NOT need to go to the government for sustinance.
    Neither should GODLY GOVENMENT be involved with CHARITY that is controlled and ministered at the home-fellowship level, where it can be easily determined if a person was just trying to FREE-LOAD on the kindness of others, for if ANY WOULD NOT WORK, NEITHER SHOULD HE EAT, was carried out in loving principle. That believers were EXPECTED to work and EARN MONEY, however little, that they could participate in the EQUAL DISTRIBUTION of the food and money gathered, having done their part to contribute their 10%.
    The FIRST 300 YEARS the “home fellowhips” OVERTURNED the WORLD for Jesus.
    They did not do it the WORLD’S WAY until Constantine declared CHRISTIANITY to be the WORLD RELIGION.
    THEN the church LEADERS quit LEADING. They no longer followed the commandment to GO into all the WORLD and preach the gospel. Instead a NEW method was taken on, mimicking the world, which is BRING the WORLD to ME and then I’ll tell them about Jesus. I want LARGER CROWDS to hear what I have to say. I don’t want to know all of you as a Shepherd does his small flock, I just want ot control LARGE GATHERINGS and be like those “shepherds” who own DOGS that they have trained to RUN AROUND and terrorize LARGE GROUPS OF SHEEP to gather where I want them so they are easier to FLEECE. And the SHEPHERDS which were ordained to CARE for the SHEEP, ignored their needs, and PRAISED HIS DOGS and he became a shepherd of DOGS who moved around great FLOCKS very impressively, which encourage others to want to do THAT FORM of SHEPHERDING, not realizing they had gone from being SHEPHERDS of FLOCKS but RULERS OF FLOCKS and shepherds / care takers of DOGS and ADMIRED others who could move HUGE FLOCKS and LARGE ENTERPRISES, and instead of ministering to the need of the FLOCKS, they just laid out things to entertain them, until, over time, it all became empty ritual and the SHEEP got tired of being HERDED and FLEECED. That’s when the MEN of the church, who are NOT STUPID, sensed in their spirits, this is a lot of UN-BIBLICAL NONSENSE and I’m not contributing to it any more.
    ANY OF THIS RING A BELL, MEN??

    • dave_aka_lambsev

      Well said Kit.

  • lome

    Jesus sees both men and women as sinners in need of salvation.
    ”Holiness attracts soul ”I am more concern with heretics coming inside the church to lead.
    Right Now , we have hirelings And not
    true shepherds in the church.

  • ansonheath

    John Renken, you have touched a nerve with me on an issue that I have been grappling with for over 10 years. Yes, the feminization of the church is a big factor in the ineffectiveness of the church in general, especially in how it affects the culture. Seems like the culture is leavening the church, but I digress.
    About 10 years ago, I attended a session that David Murrow did in Phoenix and learned quite a bit, but I still felt something was missing. Changing the music and the decor could help but something more substantive seemed to be in order. When we travel, I still stay away from some churches for the first half hour until the ‘love songs’ are done. It just messes with my attitude too much.
    As a voracious reader, especially on church history and teachings, it finally hit me. The church lacks its mission. How so?
    When Christ said: “Go ye…and make disciples of all nations…” (Matt.28:18-20), he didn’t mean ‘if you get around to it’. This clear command has run into a clear contradiction from the prophecy addicts who preach that Jesus is due back any minute, especially since everything seems to be ‘going to hell in a hand basket’.
    I would venture that most Christians, especially evangelicals, believe that our commission given to us by Jesus, if taught at all, will ultimately fail and He will have to bail us out. Why polish the brass on a sinking ship, eh?
    So what is preached on Sundays? Jesus loves you. You must have a relationship.
    My question is: Is that it? Is that all there is to it?
    My question to men now is: Are you ready for your moment in time? If I get a response, we begin the process of explaining the mission. Results are too early to really tell yet for me, but that is what our Christian journey is all about, isn’t it?
    We need Christian warriors, not ‘group huggers’. I prefer to hug my wife.
    In summary, the doctrine of pre-millennialism conflicts with the biblical mandate to take dominion of the culture and prepare for the Master’s return. As an evangelical, and a former pre-millennialist, I finally sorted this issue out and am now a converted post-millennialist. We are now living the first phase of the Kingdom of God and Jesus left us here as delegates to occupy and ‘git’erdone’ until His return. He taught that time and time again, especially in His parables.
    Changing the music and decor is just working around the edges.
    I have found the materiel from American Vision to be very helpful in my understanding of the whole role of the church and every Christian’s calling. We are now going through Dr. Marshall Foster’s series on DVD “From Terror to Triumph” with our small group and making great strides in understanding Christian history, and thus furthering our ‘growth in grace and understanding of our Lord and Savior’. My grown kids and their families are on board and all our grandkids are home schooled as well. Talk about discipling, eh!
    We have a lot of work to do, but Christ has promised us a done deal. That’s good enough for me. So it’s time for Christian warriors to show up – and they will – this generation or the next.

  • $39132868

    I think the astonishing acceleration of technological developements have DAZZLED men, for over 100 years now. The marvelous things they’ve invented have conpletely distracted them from their social roles and duties, as head of household, fhusbands and fathers, and leaders of society. They’ve been so busy creating really neato stuff, that they have fogotten that Amazing Techie Stuff does NOT a functioning, healthy civilization make.
    Nature abhors a vacuum – ad so does Civilization. Predatory HATERS of the Christ aka The Frankfurt Shul devils swooped in, whilst Western Man was off on Holiday, and immediately began to subvert and destroy. Westerners have been so busy sharing the dazzling bounty that Christian Civilization has wrought, that we have utterly fogotten Man’s Fallen Nature. The adults that ought to have been keeping vigilant watch over their flock – their own society – forgot that there is Evil in the world. Real evil. Science masks the reality of evil. How can we believe in such Medieval concepts of “evil”, when we have planes, and cell phones, and all these shiny things? Western Man, and Woman, has forgotten that fact that we are NOT all alike underneath – that is a totally wicked fallacy – and that we do not all have the same ideals and goals. Christ Haters like Hugh Hefner, and all the Nation Wreckers that have followed in his wake, have lured strong Christian men away from their proper roles, with promises of endless fun fun fun with ceaseless supplies of Bunny Girls, and Fast Cars…the parties will never end!
    Well -the Party has ended. The Promises of the Destroyer were horrible lies, as always, and Christendom lies in near ruins. Women tried to be men, and have failed miserably at the job. So what now?
    Western Man has taken a 100+ year respite from preserving his own God-Given Social order – and unless men step back into their proper roles, with love and strength, and NO apologies – we are finished.

    • dave_aka_lambsev

      The end must come, and it is not going to be outwardly pretty.

  • Merlinever

    God, Jesus, the Devil, angels, Heaven, Hell, the Holy Spirit, The Holy Trinity, Original Sin, the soul, and the afterlife are no more real than Zeus, Jove, Odhin, Allah, Santa Claus, the Tooth Fairy or the Boogey Man.

    And the Bible is a work of fiction.

    If men really wanted to lead properly, they should demonstrate the intelligence, respect for reason and reality, and courage to share the above information with all others, especially all those who are still foolish enough to waste their time going to church once a week to practice meaningless rituals and to talk to a god who isn’t there.

    • Light_V_Dark

      Nellie, you silly little Pagan»»»»YINYANG, DARKNESSLIGHT, WOMANMAN, EVILGOOD¡!

      GET OVER YOURSELF¿!¡
      ________
      http://www.dadi.org/hysteria.htm

      An intriguing analogue to the feminist hysteric is the homosexual activist. The Diagnostic and Statistical Manual (DSM), within the hysterical context, has also said that “in both sexes overt behavior is often a caricature of femininity.”

    • Light_V_Dark

      Nellie, the Li’l-Christian-POSSUMS ARE TERRIFIED OF EVIL. ATHEISTS ADORE EVIL. (SUB)HUMANISM, FEMARXISM AND GAYTHEISM, are AmeriKa’s STATE RELIGIONS.

      Early Queens of Gaytheist_Socialism, called themselves the Fabians.
      HAVE A NICE DAY»»»

      [John Maynard] Keynes was characterized by his male sweetheart, Lytton Strachey, as “A liberal and a sodomite, an atheist and a statistician.” His particular depravity was the sexual abuse of little boys. In communications to his homosexual friends, Keynes advised that they go to Tunis, “where bed and boy were also not expensive.” As a sodomistic pedophiliac, he ranged throughout the Mediterranean area in search of boys for himself and his fellow socialists.
      ___
      http://downloadpolitics.com/entry.php?537-UNHINGED-G-LIBERAL-Subhumanist-Keynsian-COWARDLY-FABIAN-GAYTHEIST-SOCIALISM&bt=722#comment722
      _____________
      Caption; Convicted Soviet Spy Harry Dexter White (left) and John Maynard Keynes (right) at the Bretton Woods Conference.

  • Jackie D. Forbes

    How about just letting the Holy Spirit guide you and your church. You can’t go wrong with that. Our church is showing great fruits, not necessarily in numbers. We don’t have football parties, but prayer meetings and deliverance classes. The Holy Spirit reigns and isn’t hindered! If the Holy Spirit is hindered, there will be stagnation.

    • John Renken

      How many men are attending your church?

      • dave_aka_lambsev

        You don’t deserve an answer to that question. If the Holy Spirit is leading, who are you to challenge Him?

        • John Renken

          Actually it is at the heart of the question. IF we were listening to the Holy Spirit men would be coming and churches wouldnt be acting the way they are.

          • dave_aka_lambsev

            I think if you listen to the Holy Spirit He will say to you that YOU must tell the story of Jesus in a way that compels them to come in! But you will find most men want to be fathers, not warriors. So YOU must show them how to be both without spilling blood! Start a deliverance ministry John, we don’t need to kick butt, we need to kick demon butt OUT OF BELIEVERS and OUT OF THE LOST!

          • MARYANN33

            Amen. Deliver the men.

          • John Renken

            So then why did Jesus turn over the tables in the temple? PS they dont have to be exclusive…I dont have to choose one or the other.

          • dave_aka_lambsev

            He overturned them because they were taking advantage of the people. They were stealing from those who came from afar and needed to buy animals for sacrifice. Be a warrior against the unseen enemies satan and demons!!! But against evil men, the Boss Jesus teaches this, which is very plainly taught, and we must take quite literally! >>>—>

            Matthew 5
            38 Ye have heard that it hath been said, An eye for an eye, and a tooth for a tooth:

            39 But I say unto you, That ye resist not evil: but whosoever shall smite thee on thy right cheek, turn to him the other also.

            40 And if any man will sue thee at the law, and take away thy coat, let him have thy cloak also.

            41 And whosoever shall compel thee to go a mile, go with him twain.

            42 Give to him that asketh thee, and from him that would borrow of thee turn not thou away.

            43 Ye have heard that it hath been said, Thou shalt love thy neighbour, and hate thine enemy.

            44 But I say unto you, Love your enemies, bless them that curse you, do good to them that hate you, and pray for them which despitefully use you, and persecute you;

            45 That ye may be the children of your Father which is in heaven: for he maketh his sun to rise on the evil and on the good, and sendeth rain on the just and on the unjust.

            46 For if ye love them which love you, what reward have ye? do not even the publicans the same?

            47 And if ye salute your brethren only, what do ye more than others? do not even the publicans so?

  • http://www.facebook.com/rose.artworks Rose Thistle Artworks

    “WHO runs YOUR church?” YOUR church? YOUR congregation? Men and women are only servants serving the Bread of Life, The Word. GOD runs HIS church even outside of buildings that are called churches. Servants need to be helping serve The Word that helps each person focus on their own relationship to GOD, teaching tools for study on how to individually grow in wisdom from His Word. Ezekiel 18:4 KJV Maybe it comes more naturally to women to serve without expecting or needing to be top dog? GOD gave men the authority and blessing to have the job of leaders of themselves and their family IF done according to His instructions – their subservience to His Will in their assigned job brings blessings to the whole family. God is very orderly. He’s already ordered who runs His church.

  • http://www.facebook.com/people/Craig-J-Townsend/100003945426141 Craig J. Townsend

    I left the church for good as I agree with Nietzsche’s rant against both Christianity and
    socialism, two twin religions that advocate the desiccation of humanity to the lowest
    common denominator. Social Justice, eco-justice,
    purpose driven drivel, renew 2000 et al, doesn’t matter what church, what denomination,
    the UN left wing idiotology has invaded it and socialism is the defacto
    catechism being taught today. The moment a pastor gets up and preaches that “all
    government is of god and must be facilely obeyed,” is a traitor. That legitimizes fascism Nazism and communism. Fellow travelers on the way
    to the global gulag. Christianity isn’t a religion for a Man especially a Man with an intellect, it’s a religion for effete men, women and children who are emotional nabobs. Don’t get me wrong, I believe in God, I just don’t believe in the god of wishy washey me tooist, go along to get along, panty waist pink theology. Can you blame the Black Muslims for doing what they have in America and abandoning black xian churches? I don’t. I admire them, at least they stood up like Men and left the reigning xian feminazis theology of male devaluation.

  • Harry

    Mr. Renken;

    You are hereby officially contradicted. It is said in scriptures that no man comes to the Father lest the spirit draw him. It has nothing to do with any of the criteria you mentioned above save what comes out of the pastors mouth. If GODs word is being taught they way HE wants it taught members of the congregation will hear the voice of the sayer and not just the voice of the preacher. GOD will draw those HE wants to hear HIS word and others will not be interested. Period. No matter what the building looks like or what gender the pastor is. The ones GOD called will come to hear HIS word. I hereby challenge you to go to http://www.pastormelissascott.com, click on the live feed and listen as much as possible for one week. And while you’re there, when reruns of Sunday Services are broadcast, count the number of men in the congregation, if you can. It’s not all the other conditions you spoke of, it’s the “MESSAGE” that’s being taught. Take my challenge. I dare you.

    • John Renken

      Harry sorry not contradicted. I totally agree that the Father draws men by the Spirit. However I also believe men should be men as they are spirit led which will draw more men. THanks

      • Harry

        That’s not what is being contradicted. What is, is your conditions to get men back into the congregation. If they are not coming to hear GODs word taught and no other reason, then they are coming for the wrong reason and GOD isn’t calling them and they shouldn’t be there to begin with. Just because one member of a family goes to hear GODs word taught doesn’t mean the others ever will.

    • John Renken

      Harry I went to the website and if I read it correctly you have to make a reservation to attend church there? I am slightly confused about that.

      • Harr y

        The reservations are because it is a live service broadcast live. Also because there is only so much room in the building. Also because certain rules apply as far as conduct during the Service and people have to understand this. This is not your regular run of the mill church service. This is GODs house and people must act accordingly. It’s not a social even, a sunday day care for the kids. A nursery is provided for those under 5. Those between 6 and 12 and sent on a bus to museums and only 12 and up are allowed in the service. You have to watch the programing to understand everything I mentioned completely. This is a procedure established back in the 70s when Dr. Scott came to this location to teach GODs word. Not man’s doctrines.

        • John Renken

          Yeah…well I am not the judge of her or her congregation if you feel led by the Spirit to do those things go for it. However, that is not how the Holy Spirit leads me for sure. We are open to all that would come.

          • Harry

            Pastor Scott and the congregation is not in question. The teaching is what I want you to hear and you don’t need a reservation to do that. You can get it right there on the web site. 24 hrs. a day. 7 days a week. The teaching is the important issue. Listen and see what I am talking about.

    • Robert Burke

      Melissa Scott uses white-board, scripture-chasing, multi-language overload to achieve a perfect level of Neuro-Linguistic Programming to mesmerize (along with her looks. ;) )

      Sounds like somebody is hypnotized.

      Lotsa preaching these days uses NLP, which amounts to a) showmanship, b) stage hypnotism, c) misdirection and d) suggestion. (always, send money.)

      Study http://www.inthatdayteachings.com and you will see Melissa Scott is simply using one of about one-hundred cons to mesmerize.

      Once you see, or understand the different archetypes, it will be hard to mesmerize you. But again, lotsa showy pastors or pastorettes use NLP, which is a) showmanship, b) stage hypnotism, c) misdirection and d) suggestion.

      And there are always tells. In Melissa Scott’s case, it is her bragging of knowing so many languages, her use of two impossible-to-follow white boards marked up to hell, her good looks, and of course… her questionable former profession.

      That’ll all do to make perfect NLP! Perfect mesmerization.

  • dave_aka_lambsev

    John 18:36
    Jesus answered, My kingdom is not of this world: if my kingdom were of this world, then would my servants fight, that I should not be delivered to the Jews: but now is my kingdom not from hence.

  • dave_aka_lambsev

    Here is a cartoon for your consideration…

    • Robert Burke

      Dave,

      God gave man a way of religion, because he made man religious.

      God also gave man a way of civil government separate from religion, because he made man political.

      This cartoon is expressing the view civil, political tension is vain.

      And that’s just not mature, not the way of the West, not ascendant!

      • dave_aka_lambsev

        And on the sixth day: “God said, Let us make man in our image, after our likeness: and let them have dominion over the fish of the sea, and over the fowl of the air, and over the cattle, and over all the earth, and over every creeping thing that creepeth upon the earth.” So God created man in his own image, in the image of God created he him; male and female created he them.

        Matthew 6:33 But seek ye first the kingdom of God, and his righteousness; and all these things shall be added unto you.

        James 1:27 Pure religion and undefiled before God and the Father is this, To visit the fatherless and widows in their affliction, and to keep himself unspotted from the world.

        (RE the cartoon, have you studied the politics of dialectical materialism?)

  • MARYANN33

    Just left a church because the pastor only wanted men in his church…Of course his men were not gifted, but he did not want anything to go on involving any woman at all…We could not touch any others etc..Yet he himself was a very rebellious sort and his god is his belly…My good church got a new pastor and I cannot stand to sit under him…very much a rebel..so no church in this city I know of, but God is finished with churches and will lead his church…He does not step on women….

  • MARYANN33

    There is neither Jew nor Greek, slave nor free, male nor female, for you are all one in Christ Jesus.

  • MARYANN33

    Read your Bible and then tell me about big men stuff…..

  • MARYANN33

    God has delivered many men of bondages through my prayers and laying on of hands…God’s choice….

  • MARYANN33

    In those days I will pour out my Spirit even on servants–men and women alike.

  • dangerouspatriot

    That’s funny because I go to church regularly but my last wife and present wife don’t. My present wife was not brought up in the church so had no idea how to worship God and Jesus until I came along. She is now baptized(Very Important) and she is also confirmed in our Faith(lutheran Church WELS) but she still doesn’t attend regularly like me. She works second shift as a CNA and every other Sunday so I can kinda understand why even though I always ask if she wants to go. She’s tired alot so there’s that but I never give up.

  • http://hoverspot.com/blog.php?userId=989817 Mike Won

    Wow wee! This article, along wid a hunerd comments, is exceptionally interesting while allowing this forum of various views.

    The back-biting of congregations previously attended forced relinquishment of regular church attendance. Differing views & of course, scandals involving evangelical misconducts, embarrassments of so called Christian institutions, Catholic paedophiles & unsportsmanlike conduct of sports, Women’s Liberation, Gay & Lesbian, Bi-sexual & Transgender issues are more than enough reasons for any chest thumpin homophobic to stay far away from a pants wearing, battle-axe preacher!

    Some of the most enlightening information reviewed here is that, “Out of seven churches, there were only two churches that God approved, (Rev. 2:8-12, 3:7-10) Smyra and Philadelphia.” The point being made by Lidia Smith is proof of the necessity to remain open to the Spirit of God’s Graces. We would much rather have found 2 of 7 from a man but gleefully [very wrong word] reluctantly concede exceptions to circumstance.

    Faith in our salvation through the blood of Christ keeps us assured that our hearts are much more secure without vile influences of churches infiltrated by severely compromised, wishy washy, phoney songs of praise & pants suits!

    Christ’s 1st visit is as a Lamb, but woe to those failing to know the next visit is as a lion!

  • joe c

    The only thing we should hear at worship is “Jesus, and Him crucified” (1 Corinthians 2:2), that is, the Gospel of Jesus’ life, death and resurrection and their significance to the life of the elect: the certain hope of eternal life. If your church preaching is “man” centered -not gender but species- quit it and find a bible believing church.

  • Light_V_Dark

    John, masculinity is DEAD.

    Pubic_Television is CELEBRATING Progressive Wimmyn. Hildog just GUSHES, in her interview. Here’s some stuff I mined a few years ago.
    ——-
    http://www.shatterdmen.com/feminist_agenda.htm

    THE FEMINIST AGENDA — In their leaders’ own words:
    —–
    4. The most merciful thing a large family can do to one of its infant members is to kill it.” (Margaret Sanger, founder of Planned Parenthood, in “Women and the New Rage,” p.67.
    —-
    1. “The simple fact is that every woman must be willing to be identified as a lesbian to be fully feminist.” (National NOW Times, Jan.1988).

    7. “Overthrowing capitalism is too small for us. We must overthrow the whole… patriarch!” (Gloria Steinhem, radical feminist leader, editor of ‘MS’ magazine).

    • Light_V_Dark

      I just LOVE, THIS ONE¿!¡
      _________
      http://www.shatterdmen.com/feminist_agenda.htm
      9. “Let’s forget about the mythical Jesus and look for encouragement,
      solace and inspiration from real women…Two thousand years of
      patriarchal rule under the shadow of the cross ought to be enough to turn women toward the feminist ‘salvation’ of this world.”
      (Annie Laurie Gaylor, “Feminist Salvation,” “The Humanist”, July/August 1988, p.37.

  • JP

    I think you make some very good points, John. Pastors do need to set the bar higher when it comes to their leadership position. While I’m not so sure football and sports need to be emphasized, the war cry definitely needs to be there. Not only should we shun the “kissing Jesus” bit, but I think the same should go for the “make Jesus your leader” appeal. Yes, we need to recognize Him as our leader, but He is so much more than that, Jesus is LORD!

  • http://www.facebook.com/barbjeanpatton Barb Patton

    sadly this is all true all true – the men no longer have cue balls, integrity or know how to man up and lead. Not only is the church leaderless so is our nation

  • http://www.facebook.com/RobertAlexander.Salvage Robert Alexander

    Many men are not in a majority of Churches because of the limp wristed preachers who preach ANOTHER GOSPEL.

  • jeff

    Really?? Christians actually go for this ?
    These types of articles are not edifying nor unifying.
    Please read your Bibles and ask for God’s wisdom…
    i’m so Thankful that our Master is so far above this type of human nonsense.

    • Light_V_Dark

      Bad news Jeff, God hates cowards*** as much as He does the Unbelieveful. sorry._____

      IDIOT_FAUX_CHRISTIAN_POSSUMS_ADDICTED_TO_FORGIVENESS, are WORSE THAN THE MURDERERS THEY ARE FORGIVING.____________________
      _____
      Revelation 21 (WYC)
      6 And he said to me, It is done; I am alpha and omega, the beginning and the end. I shall give freely of the well of quick water to him that thirsteth [I shall give freely to the thristing of the well of quick water].________________

      7 He that shall overcome, shall wield these things; and I shall be God to him, and he shall be son to me.____________________

       8 But to ***FEAREDFUL MEN, AND UNBELIEVEFUL, AND CURSED, AND MAN-QUELLERS, AND FORNICATORS, AND TO WITCHES, AND TO WORSHIPPERS OF IDOLS, AND TO ALL LIARS, THE PART OF THEM SHALL BE IN THE POOL BURNING WITH FIRE AND BRIMSTONE, THAT IS THE SECOND DEATH(^).

      ______
      http://downloadpolitics.com/entry.php?539-There-Are-Good-People-And-Evil-People

      “A coward is the fraternal twin to an Evil_ManWoman.” Me»»»

      “Christians take Scriptures out of context to try to justify or to vindicate retreat and cowardice.” Randall Terry
      ₩₩₩§§§₩₩₩¢¢¢$$$§§₩»»»

  • Light_V_Dark

    John, Christian COWARDS ARE NOT MAKING THE FINAL CUT! The little FOOLS, FEEL, THAT MY JUDGING GOOD OVER EVIL WILL LAND ME IN HELL. AND, THEY ARE THE ONES WHO WANT TO SEND ME THERE.

    I have yet to find a minister who will CONDEMN ATHEISM, A_GNOSTICISM, HOMOSEXUALITY OR ISLAM.

    Addendum»»» Please notice, I didn’t mention Buddhism, Judaism, Hinduism, etc. MASS-MURDER AND SEXUAL DEPRAVITY, DON’T APPEAR TO BE SACRAMENTS OF THESE FAITHS.

    http://downloadpolitics.com/entry.php?535-Wealth-Is-Good-SELF-DEFENSE-IS-DIVINELY-INSPIRED

    Wealth Is Good; SELF DEFENSE IS DIVINELY INSPIRED
    —–
    Jesus sent out His apostles empty handed, unshod and unarmed. TRYING, TO CONVERT JEWS. They instead, turned Jesus over to the PAGAN_PIG_DOG_ROMANS, WHO CRUCIFIED HIM.»»»»»»»»»»»»»» …

    Shortly before Jesus was BETRAYED AND ARRESTED, He had a talk with His apostles»»»»Telling them to carry money again and to ARM THEMSELVES. 

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